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Author Topic: Ukraine-a Socialistic Democracy or a Capitalistic Democracy? Wrong turn taken.  (Read 327 times)
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SilverBullet
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« on: June 28, 05:29 AM »

Is Ukraine a Socialistic Democracy or a Capitalistic Democracy? It appears that the country has taken a fatal wrong direction since Independence in 1991. How wrong can a newly fred country stake out its new course and what are the consequences for such shortsighted direction? Where are the old 5-year plans under Soviet rule that at least provided some long term goals? Ukraine is taking a wrong direction into continued corruption and capitalistic selfishness when one can observe that:

1)  The top 5 richest men in Ukraine now combined posses twice the combined capital of 48 million Ukrainians. Simply said - they got rich by taking control over prior state owned assets for Kopeks on the Hryvnia and exercised extortion and bribes to end up where they are today. A simple and general statement, but no one ended up with that much wealth in so short time in a legal way. Still they do nothing to help any fellow Ukrainians in need, homeless children, the sick and the elderly living on meager Soviet sized pensions. The richest people in Ukraine are selfish and prefer to spend lavishly on themselves abroad and in Ukraine, driving their Bentleys and living in castles surrounded by "gorrillas" keeping them alive  Roll Eyes A lifestyle not seen since prior to the Revolution of the Tsar period. Perhaps the govenrment shoudl look more cloesely into those shady business transactions and retake prior state owned assets from those individuals - just like Russia has been doing - correcting past mistakes after 1991. 

2)  That important functions in the society are being neglected like teachers and doctors making now a national average about $180 per month which is no longer sufficient to live on. No wonder both institutions are corrupt and bribes common for everything. Policemen making $200/month and nurses being underpaid. (In the USA a fully certified nurse can make $50,000 - $70,000/year which is more than enough to live on in America... the job is the same in Ukraine). What is more important for Ukrainian Government to spend money on than to fix these basic functions according to socialistic principals, make them the pillars of the society the rest of the country can grow on without corruption.

3)  Selfishness expresssed by a fews excessive spending not seen in Ukraine since the pre-revolution Tsar period. Kyiv, Dnipropetrovsk and Donetsk streets filled with new Bentleys, Mercedes 600's /AMGs, Audi R8s and the like. Each costing more than the regular Ukrainian can hope to make in a career. Even the sons and daughters (in their early 20's) of major politicians (Yushenko's son and Tymoschenko's daughter as two examples) can be seen in Kyiv as big spenders in nightclubs and restaurants, wearing very expesnive designer clothes and carrying Vertu cellphones at $5,000 +++, while driving $100,000 +++ cars. What are their parents thinking allowing such private behavior while talking about modesty and reforms in the Rada? What kind of allowances are the kids on since they have no own income to speak of? (Eugenia Tymoschenko is now married but her much older husband is not a breadwinner and both are living off her mother for practical reasons Roll Eyes

Ukraine should change it's direction, perhaps take some lessons from Norway - a constitutional, socialistic democracy whith one of the highest living standards in the world and per capita income, very few are billionaires but the majority of the population is wealthy in international terms. The State is saving a major portion of it's oil and gas revenues for future Norwegian generations and posses today one of the top 10 largest Sovereign Investment Funds in the world.  The country has been ranked # 1 by the United Nations for several years.

Instead Ukraine is looking to Amercia and the capitalistic system - every man and women for them selves.   Roll Eyes "The survival of the fittest" also in Ukraine!   A wrong turn away from the old communist principles that at least took care of more of its citizens than Ukraine does today.
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Packman
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« Reply #1 on: August 19, 04:27 PM »

Yes but when you cram the idea of the collective good down peoples throats for so many years...the opposite comes out. 

If you know something about the Cuban American community in the US, you'll find that they along with any other group that lived under communism wants nothing to do with collective "socialist" ideas or ideals.

Hopefully Ukraine will go through this period and have some social protections while not going overboard with regulation.
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SilverBullet
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« Reply #2 on: September 27, 07:45 PM »

Yeah, you are right. I would welcome 60 million Ukrainians to America because I know that most would have good Republican values.  Roll Eyes Grin Ukraine rocks!
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BritKyiv
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« Reply #3 on: September 28, 01:49 AM »

Well, I have to admit I agree with SB. (Times chenge  Grin)

Ukraine is what I call a "Dickensian Economy", is what Dickens would have written about capitalism in the 19th century. Its live or die capitalism in Ukraine.

I told a British Conservative MP visiting Ukraine last year, that what we need in Ukraine is to introduce just a little bit of socialism, tomake sure the poor are taken care of, but I cannot see it happening.

Ukraine makes makes the UK and US look like socialist states!!!!!

I still hold my theory that one day the West and the East will change places
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« Reply #4 on: September 29, 04:24 AM »

BritKyiv, I think it is already happening, Russia and China have already started tilting more and more towards capitalistic values. In China there are now so many millionaires that marinas for private yachts are in short supply. The good thing is that with wealth people are starting to think and enjoying (demanding) more and more freedom compared to in the past. As for both Ukraine and Russia, perhaps a new revolution is again needed, there are just now too many Tsars and Tsar wannabies around depressing the economic future of the people by continuing to keep average wages low despite their own successes and keeping the wealth on few hands.  Huh Undecided If you go to Lughansk, it is an interesting place for observations, the place is just nick named "Wild East" with plenty of local "entrepeneurs" SB 
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В чужо́й монасты́рь со свои́м уста́вом не хо́дят.
When in Rome, do as the Romans do.

Век живи́ — век учи́сь.
Live and learn.
Tags: Socialistic Democracy  Capitalistic Democracy 
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